Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Let's build a solid resource everyone will benefit from by making an exhaustive list of movements and compiling information on every one of those movements.
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Vagabond
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Re: Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Post by Vagabond » Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:21 am

It could be a good idea, true! I do have both a bunch of elastic bands at home, and I also rigged a plate loaded pulley system.

For the one arm push-up, Matteo is not going to be able to have his feet together with that hand position, he'll need to bring it closer in so that it's aligned with his centreline. But he's a very strong guy, and he's going to figure it out. Man, I wish I had filmed that kind of stuff when I was working on it! I didn't because the contest for it on Bodyweight Nation was closed by the time I was happy enough with my version of it.

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Massimo Kokhno
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Re: Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Post by Massimo Kokhno » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:35 am

Stall bars are a good place to try band assisted one leg Nordic curls, I have not tried yet.

Are one arm diamond pushups much harder than full planche pushups? Are they comparable in difficulty to pressing from one arm elbow lever to one arm planche?

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Re: Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Post by Vagabond » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:29 pm

I find them harder than planche push-ups, too. I also find just planche harder than the push-up part of planche push-ups. The hard part of them is always pretty much only locking out the planche. But they're easier (I think) than one arm elbow lever to one arm planche. And it depends on the technique one uses to do it. They're probably hard in slightly different ways.

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Massimo Kokhno
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Re: Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Post by Massimo Kokhno » Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:13 pm

I think the one arm planche and one arm planche pushup deserve a post of their own, but I'm not sure I should be the one to make it, I don't have much knowledge aside from some videos I've seen. Most people hold the one arm planche like a sort of handstand flag, while a few can keep the shoulders and legs at the same height.

I've seen Ziolus do one arm elbow lever to one arm planche while staying at the same height with the shoulders but slightly lowering the legs, and Andrea Larosa bend the arm noticeably and straighten it in a one arm planche more similar to a handstand flag.

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Re: Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Post by Vagabond » Tue Jan 15, 2019 6:36 pm

Yeah, I would definitely wait before making a post about it, as I've never worked it. I've done it straddle in the past, just out of curiosity, but due to the angles, I have to have my hand on something elevated to have space for my foot not to touch the floor. With a smaller straddle, I did on the floor, too. But I never worked on it. I'll get around to it eventually, tho.

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Against Gravity
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Re: Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Post by Against Gravity » Wed Jan 16, 2019 6:43 pm

Regarding the topic of one arm diamond push-up (or 'prison push-up'), based on what the author of CC wrote in the CC super FAQ, it's as hard as an 'arms-isolated' 1.4xBW close grip bench-press (when only considering raw horizontal pushing strength), plus some specific extra core engagement.
Put this into perspective...depending on your build, you will press up to 70% of your bodyweight on a pushup. (A lot of guys say 50 to 65 percent, but this is an underestimation.) You can test this yourself if you want; just do some pushups with your hands on a bathroom scale, then do the math. If you weigh a solid 220, that means you're pushing about the equivalent of 154lbs—in other words, 77lbs per arm. When you put one hand behind your back to perform a one-arm pushup, the entire 154lbs has to be pressed by the remaining arm. Effectively, you're doubling the load. Think about how that kind of force would equate to a barbell lift—the bench press. 154lbs per arm would equate to 308lbs on a two-arm bench press! In fact, the prison one-arm pushup is harder than a bench press, because whereas classical benching allows the pecs to take the load, the prison one-arm pushup places far more pressure on the elbows, forearms and front delts. It's much more like a close grip bench press, with hands only a few inches apart.

Think about this; for a fairly big athlete, the prison pushup can be the equivalent of a close-grip bench press...with 308lbs. That's a LOT of strength. By no means impossible, but freaking impressive. There are pro bodybuilders who can't do anything near that. Most men—strong guys, who train regularly—would be CRUSHED by that in a gym. I often scratch my head when guys expect to approach this Master Step seemingly overnight. How long would you have to train to achieve a strict 300+ close grip bench press? It would take a lot of time and dedication. Possibly years of intelligent, progressive workouts—if you ever got there. (How many gymrats do you know who can close press 308?) And yet most guys drop to the floor and expect to do the bodyweight equivalent in a coupla weeks. Sheesh. Remember also, that prison pushups require total body strength, including an iron midsection and back, as well as coordinated power. The stability factor is another significant issue. This means that, for most men, the prison pushup is even harder than the approximate weighted equivalent. In the joint I used to surprise people because I could bench press 315 (three wheels per
side—welded on!) quite easily, despite never training with weights. This was purely due to my mastery of the proper, feet together one arm pushup. All the big, porky lifters used to scratch their heads at how a guy could get so strong doing "just pushups". This is how. I learned my system from an older generation, who understood this shit. Forget feet-wide pushups. Always keep your feet together from day one, and you’ll not only build more useful strength and muscle, you’ll build it faster.
So probably, if training this movement again, the best approach would be one armed feet together push-ups trying to keep hand at the level of the opposite chest, and progress by decreasing elevation. Some kind of adjustable inclination/declination surface set-up would be great for that. When I tried that method, I had to go from wall-elevated one arm diamond push-ups to table-elevated one arm diamond push-ups to chair-elevated one arm diamond push-ups. The chair-elevatedprogression was probably too much - the torque on my body was so much that I coudn't avoid doing one armed one legged push-ups instead - otherwise, I was feeling like my body was ripping apart. Probably I wasn't keeping my hand closer enough to the opposite chest.

And I guess adding close-grip floor presses for low reps as accessory would help as well. Alternatively, weighted ring push-ups, or weighted one arm straddle push-ups - or any low-skill horizontal progression that allows for very tiny linear progressions each time.

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Re: Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Post by Vagabond » Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:12 pm

To be honest, I've always seen the one arm diamond push-up at being the assistance exercise on its own, because it is very much a triceps isolation movement. I'd always do stuff that uses more joints first, then finish with the one arm diamond push-up.

If the steps are too big, it seems like the solution would be to do a higher number of reps at a higher elevation, focusing on contracting the right muscles and controlling the movement. When you'd reach something like 20 very clean reps with good feeling, you could place your hand lower, and if unable right away, some slow negatives might be in order. You'll probably get it in a few trainings that way provided you've really milked the cow with the higher reps and the step isn't stupid big. An other option is to find objects you can pile in order to make the lower step a bit higher. Myself, I liked using small decreases of height associated with fairly high reps. You want leeway. Lots of leeway.

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Re: Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Post by Against Gravity » Thu Jan 17, 2019 3:58 am

I'll keep these tips in mind. I agree this is mostly a tricep-focused exercise.

Also, I'll try to keep hand placement so that in the bottom position it touches the opposite chest, like a crossed one arm push-up.
Exactly like on this video but on one arm, and keeping the elbows in rather than flared out:



I won't start working on it right now, though. I'll start working this exercise once I start to feel I'm a plateau on weighted ring dips, and need tricep-focused accessory exercises. I guess it may help with overhead pressing as well, in the elbow extension aspect of it.

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Re: Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Post by Vagabond » Thu Jan 17, 2019 4:27 am

I think it's probably a good choice to add later, yeah. I've been thinking for a while about whether or not I should work on it again, but I'm already doing enough work at the moment. I think I would use it again if I were doing only bodyweight stuff.

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Re: Some resources for movements and exercise setups

Post by Against Gravity » Thu Jan 17, 2019 4:34 am

Vagabond wrote: Thu Jan 17, 2019 4:27 am I think it's probably a good choice to add later, yeah. I've been thinking for a while about whether or not I should work on it again, but I'm already doing enough work at the moment. I think I would use it again if I were doing only bodyweight stuff.
Definitely. Unless triceps were the weakest link on any of the main exercises, it doesn't make much sense to train it.